Forum:2007-11-26. the break up, by JediMasterJay1
JediMasterJay1, 11/26/2007 7:31 AM :Hi guys I'm trying to work on a story and part of the story refers to the break up between Arnold and Helga prior to the "Patakis" series. So my question is how do yo think that arguement carried out and why did they have the arguement.? ---- Manolo, 11/26/2007 9:12 PM :Hi JedimasterJary! Well, this is an interesting question! Since the only authorized opinion's Craig Bartlett himself, I only can give you my humble opinion. And of course I can be wrong, so please don't feel like I'm talking about something I know very well or that I miself take my word like the truth. Having said that, I think Helga would have breaked up with Arnold even in San Lorenzo, and it would have been an unilateral breakup, for Helga part. I think she'll be so in despair knowing that Arnold is going to live with their parents, that she is not going to give him any chance to form a relationship with her. I think Helga would feel so guilty about all those years she hided her true feelings about Arnold, that would be hipocrythal to talk to him now that he's going to live with his parents at San Lorenzo. Of course, this is only my opinion and I wellcome any other that has a different point of view. Thank you Manolo ---- JediMasterJay1, 11/27/2007 12:38 AM :Yeah one key thing I can think of right off the back is that fact the wanted to go back to live with his parents, and he would be far away from her which I can see as being really hard on her. Well thanks for your opinion on the issue. ---- Mokichan_8000, 11/27/2007 8:48 PM :Just curious - why would they be together prior to "The Patakis"? I could see them together in their teen years (though I'd never write a fanfic about it; I despise those type of fanfics). Perhaps Helga develops an inferiority complex when she's finally with Arnold. He's so kind and charitable, and she feels as though she can't measure up, and is reminded of her strained relationship with her "perfect" sister, Olga. That would lay the groundwork for her lashing out at Arnold unexpectedly when he does something nice for her (i.e. remembers her birthday, plans a surprise party, etc.). ---- Cool, 11/29/2007 12:27 AM :If for some reason hell froze over the the second move got made, it would have to be written that they don't really "break up" as The Patakis sure wouldn't happen now. Altough it seems a series like that today would work because in the years that Craig proposed the spin-off, TV and cartoons have changed and I think its "darker tone" would be more accpetable now. I don't wanna see them fight, not after the ending in the first movie when everything ends as "nothing happened". I want some permant change and evoution in the characters. Stephen ---- genaminna, 12/3/2007 1:43 PM :I agree with Mokichan the most on this... Of course I don't have the most popular/happy p.o.v., but heh... I don't think they would have broken up just because Arnold was moving away. If you really love someone distance things like that don't really matter. If you REALLY love someone. They're just "physically" gone anyway. Yes, I've been through it, and I know how it is (tho I'm not saying it's like that for everybody... but being in college and seeing other people break up around me because of things like that... it gets hard to turn a blind eye to) Anyways, in relation to A/H (backwards, it's "HA"(for Hey Arnold), go figure :P lol), I agree that Helga may have an inferiority complex toward him, somehow, but I also think it's somewhat deeper too. I think she believes, herself, that she *could* be an openly kind person, but she can't... or rather... she's too embarrassed to... or whatever your word for it. Maybe she doesn't think that Arnold's really who he says he is when/if he says how he loves/likes her. Maybe she doesn't believe it because she doesn't believe it herself that she's a nice person, or that she's someone that someone else-- a nice guy like Arnold-- could grow to like or love. ...get what I mean? ... I still think she needs to resolve the issues with her parents before they could get back together again. Even if the Pataki's doesn't get made but TJM does, I don't want to pretend it'd all be hunky-dory afterward. Just like now, how neither are made but people still believe it. It doesn't have to mean that they pretend like nothing happened at the end. I still think they'd be bf/gf after the movie ends. I don't think Arnold would let him getting close with his parents mess up his relationship with Helga. Even if he *did* move away right after (although I think Grandma/Grandpa would want them all to move up to the city for a while), I think that Arnold would have tried to write Helga every chance he could to tell her all about his adventures down there and such. Like I said (to sum it up), I think Helga would have started the argument because: 1) (If he moved away before they broke up) ...She's insecure and doesn't believe that Arnold likes her, since they only write letters/call sometimes and don't get to see each other much. Maybe she thinks he'd be better off with someone closer to him down there? Thinks he is either having a hard time and just saving face for her sake, or thinks he's maybe possibly already cheating on her?? Who knows....>.>;; 2) (If he moved away after they broke up) ...She doesn't believe she is/can be a nice enough person for Arnold, or doesn't think she is somebody who someone could really love. This all relates back to her family problems, however. In the first (1) situation, Helga perhaps feels that she doesn't deserve his love, or that he is pretending, just to be (fake) 'nice'. In relation, it's how, maybe, she thinks her parents don't like her as much because she's not as pretty or as talented as Olga is. Maybe she thinks they're just being 'nice' (when they do) because they 'have to', based on the circumstance. In the second (2) situation, Helga feels that she can't live up to his (good-person) 'standards' and thinks she'll be mean and stubborn forever, no matter how much she tries to be nice (in front of everyone). Related to her family, it's how, maybe she feels that no matter what she does or achieves, she thinks she'll always be second best in their eyes, or when she does try to bring positive attention to herself, people don't take her seriously (well, I think Olga does, but that's a little different ^^). ...It sounds like I'm making things too serious/complicated, doesn't it? lol How the argument started is up to you, I think, but that's just my opinion on what it'd be based on... ^^; (*whew, that's a lot lol*) hope it helped ^^; I don't *want* them to fight, Steve. I just think it's kind of inevitable for them, because of their personalities. I think it'll be better for them in the end when it all sorts out, and she's not afraid to be herself anymore...:3 ---- SeraphimKiss, 12/4/2007 12:15 AM :The thought of a fight never crossed my mind, but maybe that's just because I don't like the idea of a sudden, drama-ish break-up fight. My take on it is that it crushes Helga when Arnold moves away, not exactly because he's moving away (like Gena said, physical distance is no reason to end a relationship), but because she's always thought of Arnold as a savior who has the power to make everything perfect in her life. She probably starts to realize that that's not true, but ignores it. When Arnold moves away, it forces her to acknowledge that reality doesn't live up to her perfect fantasy world. But she'd probably use the fact that Arnold is moving away as a cover-up, not telling him the real reason for their break up. (At this point, maybe even she still isn't 100% sure of the real reason). She started a relationship with Arnold before she confronted her insecurities, and bringing insecurities into a relationship (especially when they're as extreme as Helga's) will inevitably cause conflict. Even if it's not the typical angry kind of conflict (like a break up argument). She needs time to sort out her inner conflicts and build her self esteem. She *really* needs to recognize her tendency to fantasize so much that she sets herself up for disappointment, and learn not to put all her hope in dreams that will never come true. Until she's happy with herself, without depending on ridiculous fantasies to get her through the day, she can't have a healthy relationship. Hmm, a lot of this sounds like I'm projecting myself onto Helga's character. Ah well, as I said, this is just *my* take on it. No more "right" than anyone else's. But I can say that it helps a lot when you're writing if you can find a way that you connect with the character. It makes the story more personal to you and gives the story an emotional charge that makes it interesting for the readers. (Whoo, I'm very rambly today!) ---- JediMasterJay1, 12/10/2007 8:03 AM :I do agree with you SeraphimKiss which is kinda why I started the discussion cause I couldn't find the scenario in my head cause I'm a deeply Arnold x Helga fan and that in my opinion nothing in the course of time could ever change that. But also genaminna you bring up some interesting points about there relationship, and some interesting prospectives to consider. And maybe I'm playing too hard on this break up scenario, or at least to not blow it out to more than it is, I'm sure I'll find a way to write around it enough to make it flow with the story. If there is any remote curiosity about the story it takes place after the pataki's by severel years and Arnold returns to Hillwood after his spending time with his parents and is ready to start his life anew while getting back into the swing of things with his old friends including one old friend. (At this point its redundant to say to the "old friend" is, lol)